Jake Sonnenberg Wins Meadows
LAS VEGAS, Nev. — The Battle for the Belt is over.
The sixth annual Kirk L. Knutsen Classic at the Meadows School concluded with a final round that featured Harvard-Westlake School’s Jake Sonnenberg and Loyola High School’s Andrew Blay. Josh Anderson, Adam Nelson, and Todd Newkirk. On a 2-1 decision — Anderson dissented — Jake defeated Andrew to claim the Meadows Belt.
Jake is coached by Mike Bietz, Peter D. van Elswyk, and Tara Norris; Andrew is coached by James Zucker, Ashan Peiris, and John Scoggin.
LINCOLN-DOUGLAS DEBATE
BALLOTS
Meadows Ballots Rounds 1-3
Meadows Ballots Rounds 4-6
OCTAS
(16) Brentwood KA def. (1) Torrey Pines AA (Amin Aalipour)
(Van Elswyk, Scoggin, Bhatnagar)
(15) Torrey Pines IG def. (2) Lone Peak CP (Cameron Partovi)
2-1 (Nelson, Bhatnagar, *Peiris)
(3) Lone Peak OG def. (14) Chaminade College Prep NC (Neeraj Chandra)
3-0 (Hamilton, Baca, Merchant)
(4) Brentwood CW def. (13) Montgomery CC (Charles Cardinal)
2-1 (Empey, Coltin, *Hogan)
(5) Harvard Westlake BSK def. (12) Green Valley DC (Daniel Coffey)
3-0 (Anderson, Nelson, Pettit)
(11) Harvard-Westlake JS def. (6) Esperanza JP (Justin Pearce)
2-1 (*Baghai, Newkirk, Scoggin)
(7) Torrey Pines CS def. (10) Loyola AS (Andrew Seber)
3-0 (Baghai, Norris, Newkirk)
(8) Loyola AB def. (9) College Prep AK (Alex Kennedy)
3-0 (Van Elswyk, Pielstick, Merchant)
QUARTERS
(8) Loyola AB def. (16) Brentwood KAN (Kyle Allen-Niesen)
3-0 (Nelson, Van Elswyk, Empey)
(7) Torrey Pines CS over (15) Torrey Pines IG (Ilya Gaidarov)
(11) Harvard Westlake JS def. (3) Lone Peak OG (Oliver Gappmayer)
3-0 (Hamilton, Baghai, Newkirk)
(5) Brentwood CW def (4) Harvard-Westlake BSK (Ben Sprung-Kyser)
2-1 (Hogan, Scoggin, *Bhatnagar)
SEMIS
(8) Loyola AB def. (5) Brentwood CW (Cory Wynn)
3-0 (Nelson, Van Elswyk, Empey)
(11) Harvard-Westlake JS def. (7) Torrey Pines CS (Colin Scott)
2-1 (*Baghai, Anderson, Newkirk)
FINALS
(11) Harvard-Westlake JS def. (8) Loyola AB (Andrew Blay)
2-1 (*Anderson, Nelson, Newkirk)
CHAMPION [The Meadows Belt]
(11) Harvard-Westlake JS (Jake Sonnenberg)
—
TOP SPEAKERS
1. Oliver Gappmayer — Lone Peak High School (UT)
2. Cameron Partovi — Lone Peak High School (UT)
3. Andrew Blay — Loyola High School (CA)
4. Ben Sprung-Keyser — Harvard-Westlake School (CA)
5. Colin Scott — Torrey Pines High School (CA)
6. Justin Pearce — Esperanza High School (CA)
7. Andrew Seber — Loyola High School (CA)
8. Cory Wynn — Brentwood School (CA)
9. Jake Sonnenberg — Harvard-Westlake School (CA)
10. Alexandra Kennedy — College Preparatory School (CA)
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Posted from: 69.163.185.110
October 30th, 2009 17:14
[...] Meadows — Live Coverage Tim Averill Invitational (Manchester Essex) — Live Coverage [...]
Posted from: 24.120.60.99
October 30th, 2009 17:41
Round 2 is underway. A two-hour break between rounds 1 and 2 featured a trip to a nearby casino for a lunch buffet.
Posted from: 24.120.60.99
October 30th, 2009 21:40
Its 6:40pm and the last round of the day is over. And i’m in Vegas. This is a good tournament people.
Posted from: 24.120.60.99
October 30th, 2009 21:53
Good tournament? It’s the best!
Except for maybe Harker, of course. :D
Posted from: 68.108.107.196
October 30th, 2009 23:12
Some Records:
Torrey Pines IG: 1-2
West JZ: 2-1
Green Valley RM: 2-1
Green Valley NT: 2-1
Green Valley DC: 2-1
Green Valley DK: 1-2
Lone Peak OG: 3-0 (pretty sure)
Brentwood CW: 2-1 (pretty sure)
Loyola AB: 3-0
Loyola AS: 3-0/2-1
Palo Verde LS: 2-1
CPS AK: 2-1
West RK: 1-2
Lone Peak CP: 3-0
Esperanza JP: 2-1 (pretty sure)
Posted from: 75.215.245.47
October 31st, 2009 00:43
Veritas SC 2-1
Veritas NF 1-2
Posted from: 24.234.180.18
October 31st, 2009 03:06
San Dieguito Academey MS 2-1
San Dieguito Academey CK 1-2
San Dieguito Academey AR 1-2
Posted from: 12.110.45.146
October 31st, 2009 03:39
Other records:
Harvard-Westlake BS 3-0
Harvard-Westlake JS 2-1
Harvard-Westlake AB 2-1
Harvard-Westlake MC 2-1
…
Posted from: 68.120.88.16
October 31st, 2009 05:03
Also,
Loyola AS: 3-0
Loyola SW: 3-0
Lets go LOYOLA!
Posted from: 24.234.180.18
October 31st, 2009 11:53
Torrey Pines AA 3-0 !!!
Torrey Pines CS 2-1
10 am start time is really quite nice
Posted from: 75.121.204.235
October 31st, 2009 14:26
What kind-of arguments are being ran there?
Posted from: 24.120.60.99
October 31st, 2009 14:36
@11 (Mary):
Affs:
Specific Diseases/vaccines (HPV, Pneumococcal Vaccines, H1N1, H5N1, etc.)
Specific population groups (Mainly health care workers, children, elderly)
Soft Paternalism
Generic Compulsion Good
Neg:
Agency
Consult Counterplans (WHO is all I have seen)
Religious Exemptions
Hysteria/False Panic
Generic Vaccination Bad
Tax Incentives/Exemptions Counterplans
Amish People Counterplan
Hope that helps.
Posted from: 75.121.204.235
October 31st, 2009 14:59
Amish people CP? Can I assume that merely exempts the amish from the vaccine?
Posted from: 75.27.128.253
October 31st, 2009 18:57
Anyone running biopolitics?
Posted from: 24.120.60.99
October 31st, 2009 19:34
Yes. They are.
Posted from: 24.120.60.99
October 31st, 2009 20:07
I am currently watching some Soft Paternalism v language K + speaking for others K
Posted from: 24.120.60.99
October 31st, 2009 20:55
The Meadows squad has been gathering cites all weekend, and will be sending that info to everyone attending the tournament.
Thanks so much to Dan and everyone on the squad who contributed to this effort!
Posted from: 76.189.240.231
October 31st, 2009 21:12
How does soft paternalism work?
Posted from: 24.120.60.99
October 31st, 2009 21:23
Torrey Pines AA 6-0 !!!
Torrey Pines IG 4-2
Torrey Pines CS 4-2
way to complete the submarine Ilya :)
Posted from: 75.11.175.206
October 31st, 2009 22:07
AMIN come on man, win this, nobody’s gonna stop you. plus your picture will actually make it on to vbd this time. :D
Posted from: 24.120.60.99
October 31st, 2009 22:22
OCTAFINAL DEBATES:
(1) Torrey Pines AA v. (16) Brentwood KA (Van Elswyk, Scoggin, Bhatnagar) – B flight
(2) Lone Peak CP v. (15) Torrey Pines IG (Nelson, Bhatnagar, Peiris) – A flight
(3) Lone Peak OG v. (14) Chaminade College Prep NC (Hamilton, Baca, Merchant) – B flight
(4) Brentwood CW v. (13) Montgomery Academy CC (Empey, Coltin, Hogan) – A flight
(5) Harvard Westlake BS v. (12) Green Valley DC (Anderson, Nelson, Pettit) – B Flight
(6) Esperanza JP v. (11) Harvard Westlake JS (Baghai, Newkirk, Scoggin) – A flight
(7) Torrey Pines CS v. (10) Loyola AS (Baghai, Norris, Newkirk) – B flight
(8) Loyola AB v. (9) College Prep AK (Van Elswyk, Pielstick, Merchant) – A flight
Congratulations to all who cleared.
Posted from: 24.120.60.99
October 31st, 2009 22:28
TOP 10 SPEAKERS:
1- Oliver Gappmayer (Lone Peak OG)
2 – Cameron Partovi (Lone Peak CP)
3 – Andrew Blay (Loyola AB)
4 – Ben Sprung-Keyser (Harvard Westlake BS)
5 – Colin Scott (Torrey Pines CS)
6 – Justin Pearce (Esperanza JP)
7 – Andrew Seber (Loyola AS)
8 – Cory Wynn (Brentwood CW)
9 – Jake Sonnenberg (Harvard Westlake JS)
10 – Alexandra Kennedy (CPS AK)
Congratulations to these debaters.
Posted from: 76.219.139.225
October 31st, 2009 22:39
are the cites being collected limited to people at the tournament? or are they being put on the wiki?
Posted from: 24.120.60.99
October 31st, 2009 23:53
Octas A Flight:
Torrey Pines IG def Lone Peak CP (Cameron Partovi) Nelson, Bhatnagar, *Peiris
Brentwood CW def Montgomery CC (Charles Cardinal) Empey, Coltin, *Hogan
Harvard-Westlake JS def Esperanza JP (Justin Pearce) Scoggin, Newkirk, *Baghai
Loyola AB def CPS AK (Alex Kennedy) Van Elswyk, Pielstick, Merchant
The first 3 rounds were won by the AFF
Posted from: 75.27.128.253
October 31st, 2009 23:56
About people running biopolitics, what kind of alts are they running? Problemtization? Genealogy? Or silly alts like “Stop Biopower”? And are people cutting specific evidence or just using those stock Dean and Foucault 76 cards?
What is the terminal impact to soft paternalism? Soft paternalism just seems like the aff’s methodology and I would hazard a guess that not many authors justify this form of statism, I don’t understand the logic behind specifying that in the AC.
Also, what disease affs are doing more successfully? H1N1 doesn’t seem to have that high of a risk of extinction, neither does H5N1.
Posted from: 24.120.60.99
November 1st, 2009 00:59
Octas B Flight
Torrey Pines CS def Loyola As (Andrew Seber) Norris, Baghai, Newkirk
Lone Peak OG def Chaminade College Prep (Neeraj Chandra) Baca, Merchant, Hamilton
Harvard Westlake BS def Green Valley DC (Daniel Coffey) Pettit, Anderson, Nelson
Brentwood KA def Torrey Pines AA (Amin Aalipour) Bhatnagar, Scoggin, Van Elswyk*
Posted from: 24.234.180.238
November 1st, 2009 02:09
Great tournament once again!
Congratulations Colin on the bid!!!!!!! and Ilya on your ghost bid!!
Posted from: 24.234.180.238
November 1st, 2009 02:20
I second what Seber said
Posted from: 68.192.31.163
November 1st, 2009 02:51
I … third(?) what Seber said.
Lol
Posted from: 24.234.180.238
November 1st, 2009 03:06
I second what Ben said
I think I just ripped a hole in the universe…
Posted from: 24.234.180.238
November 1st, 2009 03:12
I second what Fritz said about what Ben said about what Fritz said about what Seber said.
Posted from: 71.136.229.73
November 1st, 2009 03:16
okay i’m not gonna bother figuring out what i second.
Congrats Colin and Ilya on the bids! :)
Posted from: 68.120.88.16
November 1st, 2009 03:16
wartinbee u killed it
Posted from: 98.200.240.94
November 1st, 2009 05:52
what bid level is this tournament? and who coaches lone peak / where is that?
Posted from: 76.189.240.231
November 1st, 2009 10:28
I don’t even understand how soft paternailsm even solves. Just skewing someone’s decisions may not force them to get compulsorily vaccinated. You need hard paternalism for that right?
Posted from: 24.120.187.133
November 1st, 2009 10:56
josh bentley, sherry duncan, melia willoughby, and abbie treybig coach the lone peak team we’re in highland, utah.
congratulations on the bid round oliver, represent us well.
Posted from: 24.234.180.238
November 1st, 2009 12:16
Quarters:
Loyola AB vs. Brentwood KA
Brentwood CW vs. Harvard-Westlake BS
Torrey Pines CS over Torrey Pines IG (Ilya Gaidarov)
Lone Peak OG vs. Harvard-Westlake JS
congrats to Ilya on the ghost, Colin on the bid, everyone who cleared.
thanks to Dan for an awesome tournament so far with sweet 10AM start times.
And to those of us in quarters, lets make it happen
Posted from: 24.120.60.99
November 1st, 2009 13:18
Quarters – Start Time 10am
Brentwood CW v Harvard-Westlake BS (Hogan, Scoggin, Bhatnagar)
Brentwood KA v Loyola AB (Nelson, Van Elswyk, Empey)
Lone Peak OG v Harvard Westlake JS (Hamilton, Baghai, Newkirk)
Torrey Pines IG v Torrey Pines CS
Posted from: 24.17.210.22
November 1st, 2009 13:40
Let’s go Oliver. Rep (previously) WA debate. And congrats to everyone who cleared.
Posted from: 24.120.60.99
November 1st, 2009 14:59
jake def. oliver 3-0
Posted from: 24.120.60.99
November 1st, 2009 15:42
Quarters Results
Brentwood CW def Harvard-Westlake BS (Ben Sprung-Kyser) Hogan, Scoggin, *Bhatnagar
Loyola AB def Brentwood KA Kyle Allen-Niesen) Nelson, Van Elswyk, Empey
Harvard Westlake JS def Lone Peak OG (Oliver Gappmayer) Hamilton, Baghai, Newkirk
Torrey Pines CS over Torrey Pines IG
Semis (now underway)
Loyola AB v Brentwood CW (Nelson, Van Elswyk, Empey)
Torrey Pines CS v Harvard-Westlake JS (Baghhai, Anderson, Newkirk)
Posted from: 138.251.233.62
November 1st, 2009 15:50
CONGRATS CORY ON THE BID!!
CONGRATS KYLE ON THE BID ROUND!!
Nice job Bwood!!
Posted from: 24.120.60.99
November 1st, 2009 16:34
Semis Results
Loyola AB def Brentwood CW (Cory Wynn) Nelson, Van Elswyk, Empey
Harvard-Westlake JS def Torrey Pines CS (Colin Scott) *Baghhai, Anderson, Newkirk
Finals – 1pm start time
Loyola AB (Aff) v Harvard-Westlake JS (Anderson, Nelson, Newkirk)
Posted from: 75.25.160.95
November 1st, 2009 17:49
AWESOME JOB ILYA AND COLIN ON THE BIDS, AND AMIN ON GOING 6-0!!!!!!
Posted from: 24.120.60.99
November 1st, 2009 17:58
Finals Results
Harvard-Westlake JS def Loyola AB (Andrew Blay) *Anderson, Nelson, Newkirk
Champion: Harvard-Westlake JS (Jake Sonnenberg)
Posted from: 68.120.88.16
November 1st, 2009 17:58
Blay AWESOME job on gettin to finals and on the bid! way to rep loyola
Posted from: 128.91.69.241
November 1st, 2009 18:24
CONGRAAAAAATS JAKE! Way to show everyone what you and HW are made of. Its fitting that you would get a wrestling belt. Keep up the good work..your headed towards big things. Ben, your continually impressing everyone and we all know your head for great success and lots of bids. Hell ya guys im so proud of you all.
Cory and Blay you know i have to show you my love in this post too. Great work to you both.. both of you deserve this a great deal. 3 of 4 bids to LA. congrats guys..
Bietz continually proving you know your stuff. And PDVE/Tara – showing you mean serious serious business. Im thrilled.
Posted from: 96.242.58.139
November 1st, 2009 18:51
good work jake sonnenberg, claiming a fifth bid (and a belt) for koshy/nebel.
congrats to cory and colin too!
Posted from: 70.118.121.225
November 1st, 2009 18:54
Congrats to JS on the win and to Cory on the bid!
Re: Intel sharing (a few of the posts between 11 and 25, and I’m sure many others are wondering)
Wouldn’t it be easier if people just disclosed on the NDCA wiki? To all debaters who competed this weekend–nobody’s gonna force you this time, but please realize that intel is a public good; if you disclose, others will follow, and you won’t be at a disadvantage when participation rates increase. If you opt in, that’s one less free-rider. Don’t let the good Sept/Oct vibes of openness fall by the wayside…
Props to Adam Nelson and Harker for already doing this.
Posted from: 75.85.110.214
November 1st, 2009 19:05
JP reppin. public school EHS. W00t!
Posted from: 169.229.99.132
November 1st, 2009 19:20
Cory- you’re a beast, congrats on the bid
Kyle- way to be, you’ll be beating cory in 6 months (don’t tell him)
Blay- you suck, congrats anyway
JAnderson- all my love
also congrats to Sonnenberg, glad to see the win in the family- LA HEGE!
Bwood, I’ll come by practice next time I’m in LA, you guys are awesome.
Posted from: 129.170.132.155
November 1st, 2009 19:25
cory- YESSSSSSS. thank you
kyle- YESSSSSSS. you’re awesome and the bids will be comin shortly
blay- nice work, way to rep the l dot a dot
hdub- you guys are unbelievable and i couldnt be more excited to see the (middle school) athletic rivalry become a debate rivalry too. and also curtis school 4 life
la- this was a great coming out party
and thanks miso for the formatting
Posted from: 67.81.3.29
November 1st, 2009 19:29
COLIN COLIN COLIN COLIN COLIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
congrats on the bid, soldier! bid number four for Irene’s Army!
YOU ARE SO AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!! and you deserve this 1000%
Posted from: 72.193.177.156
November 1st, 2009 19:34
This was an excellent tournament. The schedule wasn’t too intense, everything ran on time, the generous hospitality of the Meadows School was, as usual, top class. Congratulations to all the debaters and a big thanks to Dan Meyers for helping bring circuit debate to Southern Nevada.
Posted from: 75.80.137.113
November 1st, 2009 22:55
I want to thank the Meadows Team for a fantastic tournament experience. Everything from the food to tab was impeccable and made debating even more fun than usual =D
Congratz to Blay for Finals and Seber for Octos. You will get the bid next weekened bud dont even worry about it.
Cory you deserved this and i am really happy for you man.
harvard-westlake dominated and Jake my rounds with you were fun and fast. Good job on the win.
Amin and Ilya you guys are awesome :)
Posted from: 128.62.61.92
November 1st, 2009 23:19
Congrats to the Brentwood Squad for an outstanding weekend, especially Cory for finally breaking through and Kyle for having an amazing run!
Posted from: 71.154.215.130
November 1st, 2009 23:30
Congrats Colin Ilya and Amin :)
Posted from: 98.14.255.196
November 1st, 2009 23:55
CONGRATULATIONS to JAKE and the entire H-W squad on a GREAT team performance! Congratulations as well to Andrew on reaching finals, to Colin and Cory on their bids, and to Charles — Cruz/Jeffers ‘08! — on reaching outrounds.
Finally, congratulations to Oliver on placing as top speaker.
Posted from: 72.130.142.156
November 2nd, 2009 00:07
Congrats to Colin on the well-deserved breakthrough and everyone else who bid. Also congrats to Oliver and Cameron on taking the top two speaker awards and for being solid all tournament; you guys will get the bids for sure. And congrats to Amin for being top seed at his first circuit tourney this year; that’s pretty damn impressive.
Thanks to Dan and the Meadows crew for an extremely well-run and hospitable tournament; this was an experience valuable to any debater.
Posted from: 76.176.139.23
November 2nd, 2009 00:09
Big ups to Cory! You totally earned it. Also congrats to the H-W crew, ya’ll dominated. Thanks meadows for the awesome tournament. I regret not being there the passed few years. It was incredible fun and relaxed, great job!
Posted from: 24.161.175.30
November 2nd, 2009 00:15
Major congrats to cory and colin on the bid! First of many for both of you. Also, congrats to Ben, Ilya, Amin, Justin, and Andrew on solid showings.
And last but not least, congrats to Cam and Tara for being awesome assistant coaches:)
Posted from: 67.186.82.128
November 2nd, 2009 01:37
Congrats Neeraj on breaking :)
Posted from: 165.124.138.225
November 2nd, 2009 01:44
Wooooooo Colin!
Posted from: 169.232.187.219
November 2nd, 2009 02:37
Congrats jake! I’m so proud.
Ben, you’re probably the smartest kid i know. this weekend proves that you can debate, too. keep it up.
Brendan, michelle, and adam, I was so impressed this weekend. You’re all turning into amazing debaters so early in your careers.
Cory, congrats on the bid :). can’t wait to see what else you do.
And lastly, thanks to Dan and the Meadows team to hosting a great tournament.
Posted from: 128.97.75.222
November 2nd, 2009 02:41
Congrats to all debaters. The rounds I saw were very impressive, and I enjoyed judging them. To those who got bids–great job! And to those who came just short–you’ll get there.
Thanks Dan for hosting an awesome tournament. The hospitality, competition, schedule, and overall feel of the tournament was wonderful.
Posted from: 71.104.147.161
November 2nd, 2009 03:14
I had an awesome time judging this weekend! Thanks so much to Dan and the meadows team for the hospitality.
I want to congratulate Colin,Ilya,and Cory on the bids, Amin for being top seed and undefeated in prelims, Justin for being mad impressive when I judged him, and Jake for being freaking awesome at debate and winning the freaking tournament!
Posted from: 165.124.219.135
November 2nd, 2009 14:56
Great job Colin. Your halfway there.
Posted from: 24.120.60.99
November 2nd, 2009 15:06
We are still working on assembling the citations into one coherent and consistently formatted document (quite the task). I do want to thank those who immediately cooperated and did not harass my novices in their efforts to collect these citations. Though, as much novice work goes, many of these citations may be incomplete. I apologize for that. It is our goal to have the document ready this evening with all the citations collected my all TMS team members this weekend.
Posted from: 76.189.240.231
November 2nd, 2009 17:49
Will the cites be publically available?
Posted from: 76.175.50.43
November 2nd, 2009 18:31
HW, these are the kind of weekends that make being a debate coach incredible. Thanks for all your hardwork.
Cory, thanks for reppin’ the Babb/van Elswyk lab even though you had to walk over HW to do it. ;)
Dan, thanks for running what is undeniably one of the best tournaments in the country. Best start times, best trophy, best location, and best host. If you’re reading at home and have never been to Meadows, then don’t miss out next season.
Posted from: 67.159.182.18
November 2nd, 2009 20:57
congrats colin on earning your cake. Ilya, if you request one i GUESS i can bake another…
Posted from: 76.94.64.174
November 2nd, 2009 21:26
Thanks to everyone for all the support. Big thanks to Dan and the meadows team for an amazing tournament. Congratulations to everyone who debated, especially Andrew Blay. We had two great rounds this weekend and I’m sure we will debate again this year. Also, Bietz, Tara, and Peter: you guys are awesome. Thanks again to everyone!
Posted from: 68.181.255.116
November 2nd, 2009 22:17
Woot Loyola! Congrats to Blay on the finals and adding another bid to your already extremely successful year. And congrats to Seber for the octas showing.
Congrats to the Torrey Pines crew!
Congrats to Cory Wynn on the bid!
And congrats to Harvard Westlake for some pretty good domination, especially Jake!
By the way, which charity did the donations for speaker awards go to this year? I always thought that was cool and more tournaments should do it.
And when will Meadows get a quarters bid? Every year I went both the debater and judge pools were excellent and tab is run so smooth. Is the only thing holding it back the size? (I don’t know how many debaters were there this year.)
Posted from: 68.104.2.152
November 2nd, 2009 22:45
@ Tim (#73)
I really like that feature of our tournament as well. Trophies seem pretty trivial when money can be put to much better uses. This year we gave to two charities ($250 each).
Best Buddies – a program started by one of our former debater that is a big brother/sister type program for mentally and physically handicapped kids.
Microbank – a program started by one of our former debaters, and run by Kirk Knutsen, that raises funds and then lends the money back out in the form of microloans. They have been targeting single mothers in Africa as of late.
As for the size. We were at 65 when I left for St. Marks. By the time I got back we were at 55 due to a large number of unforeseen circumstances for several teams. The tournament ran with 54 debaters this year from 5 different states (unless I’m missing one).
Posted from: 67.220.28.38
November 2nd, 2009 23:39
Thanks to Dan for sharing source citation with the community. Things like this will make debate rounds much better.
What about the charities? Did the top speaker(s) get to choose a charity to which to donate money?
Posted from: 68.104.2.152
November 3rd, 2009 02:08
Haha. No. We (Tim Alderete and myself) discuss each year which charity to donate to. Usually it’s something closely tied to the school and/or our students. This year we decided to share the love (and funds) between two charities.
Regarding the citations. I’ve sent the citations to Bietz to put up on VBD. As a general disclaimer. I have done ZERO work on this. It was all done by students of varying experience levels. Some is super specific. Some borders on useless. Formatting is sporadically consistent (is that possible?). Regardless, we all hope it has some value to the community.
Posted from: 75.121.204.235
November 3rd, 2009 21:52
When can we expect this to be posted?
Posted from: 68.104.2.152
November 4th, 2009 00:50
Let’s try this: http://www.box.net/shared/qal93uak7l
Posted from: 75.121.204.235
November 4th, 2009 00:59
Thank-you.
Posted from: 68.104.2.152
November 4th, 2009 01:07
Welcome. As an additional caution, I have already learned that some of the citations are incorrectly attributed. This does not surprise me, but it’s good for others to know.
Posted from: 128.135.241.137
November 4th, 2009 02:29
I find it funny that people are asking for these cites, but people are still really against disclosure. I feel like this could be a demonstration of that free-riding problem people brought up.
Posted from: 67.220.28.38
November 4th, 2009 04:04
as has been advocated before, we should have citation-centric, outline based disclosure with a short descriptions of the general argument being made
Posted from: 24.120.60.99
November 4th, 2009 15:05
Some statistics (true as of 11:05am PST):
# of people with information on the Wiki – 4 (over 2 teams)
# of people who have downloaded cites – 77
# of people who debated the topic last weekend – 103 (between TMS and Caucus)
Posted from: 67.220.28.38
November 4th, 2009 17:52
and, of course, the number of downloads isnt at all accurate of how many people are actually using the meadows tournament cites. my one download allowed 10+ people to see it (the edina team). which is a good thing!
Posted from: 76.176.139.23
November 5th, 2009 01:02
Dan the ONE ballot i wanted to read didn’t scan! Nooooo! hahaha =P
Posted from: 128.252.254.4
November 5th, 2009 01:34
@spirtos
It’s not a free-rider problem. It’s that one would be at a competitive disadvantage if everyone else had the cites and they didn’t. Whether you like disclosure is irrelevant to the fact that it affects competitive equity.
Posted from: 72.129.83.105
November 5th, 2009 16:14
@ spirit
+1