Nominations for Mid-season VBDeez
LOS ANGELES, Cali. — Each year all of us go attend anywhere from 5 to 30 tournaments a year. Many tournament directors rise to the occasion and, for their tournament or weekend, make sure they pull out all the stops to make sure we all have a great experience. Some, maybe not so much. We also know that there are judges who will work diligently each and every round to make thorough, thoughtful decisions. Some judges, not so much. So, here is the opportunity for the community to give recognition to the winners and the needs-to-improvers of the first half of the 08/09 debate season.
We will announce the awards on New Year’s Day 2009. All winners will be eligible for the End of Season VBDeez as well.
To submit a nomination, you must email Mike Bietz with the category, the nominee and a 100 word (not to exceed 150 words) explanation of your nomination. Nominations are due by December 27, 2008. Nominations left in comments will not count unless they are also emailed to Bietz.
Each category also has a “regional” component as well. Please include which from which region you are nominating. Regions are simple — they are each of the four timezones plus north or south (Alaska and Hawaii, even though I believe to be a state you need to touch a state) are also allowed. You will be entered into the Pacific North and South, respectively. So, if you have a nomination for a tournament in Minnesota, you would nominate it for Central North. For Texas, you would be Central South. If you tell us the state and city, we will just decide the region for you.
Each category also has a “national” component. “National” tournaments are tournaments that have a truly “national” draw. To be a National draw, you should draw debaters from at least 3 of the 4 time zones.
The Categories:
Tournament Awards:
Best Hospitality
Best Judging Pool
Best Competition
Best Non-bid Tournament
Best Upstart Tournament (under 2-years old) – regional only
Best Trophies
Best Competitor Giveaway (gifts to all competitors)
Most Efficient Tab Room
Best Tournament Food
Best Tournament Location
Best Tournament Schedule
Best Nearby Dining
Judge Awards
Best Judge
Most Helpful RFD
Squirreler
Most Entertaining RFD
Point Fairy
Point Miser
Most Underrated Judge
Best First-Year-Out Judge
Most Likely to Hold Up a Tournament
Popularity: 4% [?]
test
Posted from: 68.199.21.95
December 9th, 2008 12:54
Everyone nominate Alli Goffman for Squirrler for squirreling on a 9 person panel at Bump!
Posted from: 67.165.107.38
December 9th, 2008 14:01
are you sure this isnt an elaborate deez nuts joke?
Posted from: 66.75.244.56
December 9th, 2008 14:20
in before “nsd hacks”
Posted from: 204.186.151.4
December 9th, 2008 14:56
Alex W. is the squirrler for sure hahaha…only 5 outrounds at one tournament! lol
And then best first year out judge ZAMBITO
Best judge Konya
And the most helpful RFD EVER GOES TO JOSHHHH MARSHALL!!!!!
best coach (if anyone is counting) RZ
Posted from: 96.229.143.242
December 9th, 2008 15:04
Before things got out of hand, I was reminded that things can get pretty nasty on these threads. So I’ve eliminated the more dubious awards.
Posted from: 71.214.198.119
December 9th, 2008 15:28
most incoherent rfd is probably one of the “dubious” awards you forgot to get rid of.
Posted from: 96.229.143.242
December 9th, 2008 15:29
incoherent rfd could be funny. but you might be right.
any categories i might be missing?
Posted from: 207.38.220.36
December 9th, 2008 15:30
Hey, I’ve never squirrelled. I’ve been on the top of 1-2 decisions, I admit…
Posted from: 71.139.23.60
December 9th, 2008 15:58
What is the point of this?
Posted from: 96.229.143.242
December 9th, 2008 16:08
To have some fun giving recognition to tournaments and tournament directors and judges.
Posted from: 66.108.128.126
December 9th, 2008 16:28
i nominate chris castillo, the most preferred ld critic in the country, for best judge. nuff said
Posted from: 98.112.164.45
December 9th, 2008 16:48
bronx for hospitality
Posted from: 70.138.99.19
December 9th, 2008 17:08
the bronx rr has the best hospitality of any event. tastes of the world is a different story.
Posted from: 72.213.162.95
December 9th, 2008 17:21
Eugh. The “best” awards are good, but the other, more defamatory awards strike me as very condescending. Please have some consideration, quys.
Posted from: 96.229.143.242
December 9th, 2008 17:42
Alright. Now we should be completely rated G. Is it ok that people get recognized for their squirreling, low points or holding up tournaments? I think so…
Posted from: 71.214.198.119
December 9th, 2008 17:44
how about best tournament schedule? best tournament food? best location?
Posted from: 96.229.143.242
December 9th, 2008 17:47
like those. I’ll add them.
Posted from: 160.94.91.227
December 9th, 2008 18:01
Point Miser = Cyndy Woodhouse
Posted from: 72.213.162.95
December 9th, 2008 18:19
@15, wouldn’t that humiliate some hard-working people?
Posted from: 98.114.207.11
December 9th, 2008 18:27
Liberty Bell Classic for best nonbid tournament, definitely.
Posted from: 96.229.143.242
December 9th, 2008 18:43
why would a point miser humiliate someone? It’s their choice to give low points. I might be in the running… i haven’t given a 30 since 1997.
why would someone be humiliated for holding up a tournament? many many many are notorious for having to go have a cigarette, go get a drink, do anything to not start their round on time…
i assume the last one that might humiliate someone is for squirrelling? well, plenty of people will wear that award with pride. i think we might even have a lifetime achievement possibility version of that one!
Posted from: 69.105.30.19
December 9th, 2008 19:05
most efficient tab room: the meadows
Posted from: 68.199.21.95
December 9th, 2008 19:53
Best Trophies: Hen Hud Crappy Prizes
Posted from: 71.214.198.119
December 9th, 2008 20:22
bietz, who received that 30 in 1997?
Posted from: 128.12.77.106
December 9th, 2008 20:33
hahahahah this is a great name for an award. i nominate richard diaz for everything.
Posted from: 205.238.239.129
December 9th, 2008 21:16
best on bid: LBC by a longshot!
Posted from: 66.41.156.246
December 9th, 2008 21:32
Most Entertaining RFD: very little can beat the Paul Bellus standing RFD.
Posted from: 68.117.67.91
December 9th, 2008 21:40
Truth. Every sentence ending with “right” and the inevitable reference to Agamben. Classic.
Posted from: 24.164.191.184
December 9th, 2008 21:43
although it hasn’t happened yet this year, ridge should be best non-bid tourney
Posted from: 71.214.198.119
December 9th, 2008 21:48
toc is probably the best non-bid tourney….
Posted from: 32.147.254.58
December 9th, 2008 21:55
Juju you’re one to talk about speaks… Didn’t you give out like 8 25′s @ wake ?
Posted from: 98.201.178.59
December 9th, 2008 22:55
best tournament food: stacy’s now defunct[?] lonestar round robin; the fajitas were amazing, and those hockaday parents aren’t bad cooks.
best non-bid: TFA state hands down. EXTREMELY diverse judging pool, and last year 11/16 of octs kids went to TOC, and 8/8 in quarters on was nothing but [toc qualled debaters].
best tournament location: bronx
best tournament schedule: st. marks
squirreler: everybody’s thinking wes craven, might as well go ahead and say it.
worst judge: probably me
point fairy: cruz
point miser: does corbin still count? i’ve heard him give some pretty awful ones consistently
most helpful rfd / best judge: castillo
how about a worst tournament location? or how about a ‘most intimidating coach in the room while giving an rfd’?
Posted from: 75.73.64.159
December 9th, 2008 23:20
Tournament Awards:
Best Hospitality
Of tournaments I’ve been to so far this year, either Bronx or Valley.
Best Judging Pool
Greenhill, with AV and Valley as excellent runners up.
Best Competition
Glenbrooks, with Greenhill as a very close runner-up.
Best Non-bid Tournament
We weren’t able to make it this year, but Millard West has always claimed this distinction for me (and should be considered for getting its bid back, IMO). Hopkins I also wasn’t at but also sounded like it was quite good.
Best Upstart Tournament (under 2-years old) – regional only
In Minnesota, the U of M tournament was excellent in its first year back after a brief hiatus.
Best Trophies
Caucuses, as always, no contest. Apple Valley is the runner up, followed by Valley (Hammer of Doom), Greenhill and Glenbrooks
Best Competitor Giveaway (gifts to all competitors)
Bronx RR–personalized acrylic (or whatever–I think that’s what they are) trophies; it’s nice to have at least one thing from your debate career that has your name on it
Most Efficient Tab Room
Any tournament tabbed by Cherian Koshy and/or Zach Prax (meaning, for all intents and purposes, any LD tournament in Minnesota)
Best Tournament Food
Again, Bronx RR–I don’t even eat sushi and I still have to give this one to a tournament that orders $1500-worth of the stuff on massive “boats”. Dowling RR this Thursday may be stiff competition, though–it’s always been the tournament that’s most up my alley food-wise, what with the gigantic plates of cookies and such.
Best Tournament Location
It hasn’t happened yet, but Blake. Or Marx, except I heard that wasn’t in the hotel this year. I like tournaments in hotels.
Best Tournament Schedule
Greenhill–I’m a big fan of Saturday-Sunday for tournaments that draw primarily teams coming from a distance that would otherwise have to miss school. Apple Valley is the runner up just for the overall efficiency of the tournament and for managing to have really good judging even with single-flighted rounds.
Best Nearby Dining
There’s a surprising quantity of good food in Des Moines, and it’s all easy to get to and park at, so I’ll say Valley and Dowling.
Judge Awards
Best Judge
Adam To–oh wait, *”best”*.
Most Helpful RFD
I’m really not sure that I’ve actually listened to an entire RFD since I graduated from high school. Debaters are probably better at answering this one…
Squirreler
Dunno…this used to be me my first couple years out, until I started cheating off the ballot of the judge closest to me and making the same decision they did. The most epic squirrel I can remember, I think, was in finals of the Harker RR a couple years ago when (if I’m remembering right) Nick managed to be on bottom of a 5-0 by being the lone dissenting component of the 11-member student vote.
Most Entertaining RFD
I have to agree with Adam and Chris on this one.
Point Fairy
See, I have people in mind for this award who’ve consistently been point fairies to us, but if I point them out then maybe they’ll stop doing it…
Point Miser
This wasn’t actually this year, but I’m going to give this one to Melissa Patel for last year, at Dowling, not just signing her ballot negative but *disclosing* for the negative and giving an RFD before the 2AR, which she had to then be reminded had not yet occurred, and then giving the debater she’d disclosed for before the end of the round a 27.5.
Most Underrated Judge
Again, I have some nominees, but I’m not sure if I should say them. I mean, it’s sorta a backhanded compliment, isn’t it, to say “This guy isn’t *nearly* as bad as judge as everyone’s always saying he is!”?
Best First-Year-Out Judge
The best first-year-out judge is a first-year-out judge who’s not judging because the tournament recognizes that no one under the age of 25 is qualified to judge a debate round. The second best first-year-out judge is one who’s judging the 0-4 round in novice.
Most Likely to Hold Up a Tournament
Me, at tournaments that make me write ballots. That’s part statement of fact (I write slow), part threat (you heard me, PC).
Posted from: 98.201.178.59
December 9th, 2008 23:28
okay after reading christians post i take back my nomination for myself as worst judge after his account of point miser-ing
Posted from: 66.75.244.56
December 10th, 2008 00:08
anon: the debater was leah halvorson, and i think i deserve a new category and an award for “most absurd retention of random debate facts”
Posted from: 68.104.1.44
December 10th, 2008 00:29
I have confirmed that Smitty is correct. I don’t know if a new category is called for, but a restraining order may be…
Posted from: 166.129.156.58
December 10th, 2008 00:30
i think smitty could beat cruz in a debate trivia showdown.
Posted from: 71.63.156.220
December 10th, 2008 01:35
Phelan: “Juju you’re one to talk about speaks… Didn’t you give out like 8 25’s @ wake ?”
No, I would never give out 8 25′s. It was straight 23′s.
Posted from: 72.177.194.67
December 10th, 2008 02:40
Castillo is a hack, I was going to nominate him for most overrated until Bietz took the category down
Posted from: 98.14.255.196
December 10th, 2008 06:12
One day, we’ll go head-to-head. :o)
I remember you telling us WHY she got the 30! She sat down after a minute or two into the 2NR, ’cause she said everything that needed to be said.
Posted from: 64.253.166.252
December 10th, 2008 07:00
Bless you Christian – Fred, I and Millard West thank you for your comments!
Posted from: 71.212.144.17
December 10th, 2008 08:11
@2: Bietz’ “30″ controversy… if memory serves me correctly, the last 30 Bietz gave was to Adam Magnus from Isidore Newman in that same season (97-98). The reason Bietz had for the 30 was the one Cruzation applied to Leah: he gave a 2 minute 2NR that was incredibly strong. Given how good Newman AM was, this would not surprise me.
As for the 30 to AV LH… this did happen, but earlier in the season, so the *last* 30 was to Newman AM.
Back to work for me… I just wanted to be sure that my debate trivia underlings didn’t get their britches too messy.
mm.
Posted from: 70.138.99.19
December 10th, 2008 09:26
i don’t know why there are people who are so upset about the “worst judge” category or whatever the wording and variations were before bietz took them down.
there are awful judges who consistently judge outrounds at big tournaments and we should recognize them with awards.
Posted from: 24.120.60.99
December 10th, 2008 09:56
+1 to Gary
Posted from: 205.221.1.253
December 10th, 2008 10:08
Tournament Awards:
Best Hospitality
Harker, hands down.
Best Judging Pool
Apple Valley.
Best Competition
Greenhill and the Glenbrooks share this so far this year, I think.
Best Non-bid Tournament
Millard West was FABULOUS this year but it no longer qualifies for the award because it is a finals bid in PF. I am particular to Des Moines Roosevelt on this one.
Best Upstart Tournament (under 2-years old) – regional only
Ionno, all of our DM tournaments are really old. How about “The Dave McGinnis Edition of The Valley Mid-America Cup”?
Best Trophies
Second Christian – the George Washington busts are sweet.
I am kind of partial to the marble apples as well, though…
Best Competitor Giveaway (gifts to all competitors)
They have these? Where?
Most Efficient Tab Room
Ernie Rose and Scott Tomsu at Valley. Cherian Koshy at anywhere Cherian Koshy tabs.
Best Tournament Food
HAAAAARRRRKEEEEEEERRRRR.
Best Tournament Location
Harker. Gotta love the South Bay.
Best Tournament Schedule
Glenbrooks. You get out early enough each day to take the kids out for a meal and get to bed at a reasonable hour, and they still pack in the rounds.
Best Nearby Dining
No contest. St. Mark’s / Greenhill. You’ve got:
THE CLAY PIT
THE BLUE GOOSE
GENKI SUSHI
… all within a couple of miles.
Judge Awards
Best Judge
Tom Evnen would be high on the list but it’s hard to pick just one.
Most Helpful RFD
… hmm, have to think more
Squirreler
Wesley Beena Craven Koshy
Most Entertaining RFD
Wesley Craven
Point Fairy
I agree with Christian – I don’t want these folks to become too self-conscious. :)
Point Miser
Me.
Most Underrated Judge
Me. I’m brilliant!
Best First-Year-Out Judge
Catterton.
Most Likely to Hold Up a Tournament
Rob Schebel, he of the thirty-minute PFD oral critiques.
Posted from: 205.202.240.124
December 10th, 2008 10:14
Blake is an amazing tournament.
My favorite LD judge is probably Wes Craven, because he squirrels as much as I do and, as Bietz once commented at the TOC, circus music plays in his head nonstop.
I am one of the biggest squirrel judges on the planet but always consider myself correct, except for one time when I realized I had made an error in judgment after listening to a critique by the excellent coach from a school in New Orleans, who I actually know fairly well, although I am no longer sure he still coaches there, and whose name now escapes me because I am getting too damn old. But he’s a truly great coach and judge. Some one remind me of his name if you can deduce it from my vague description.
I don’t know if this is a category, but the all-time greatest character and most amazing person who ever coached debate (and still does, I think in some foreign land) is the inimitable Mark Webber.
And Christian, I do thank you for mentioning our humble tournament at Milard West. We are growing, we did get a bid back in PF only, and would love to have you and your students back next year.
Fred Robertson
Posted from: 205.202.240.124
December 10th, 2008 10:17
Thanks to dave mcginnis also for giving us some love.
fred robertson
Posted from: 70.138.99.19
December 10th, 2008 11:17
Best Tournament Schedule: stanford.
Posted from: 209.181.228.22
December 10th, 2008 11:56
best non-bid tournament – U of MN
Great schedule, and was very competitive
Posted from: 128.252.78.87
December 10th, 2008 12:46
worst judge is the unholy combination of Mike Spirtos and Tim Greenfield obv. separated they’re fine though.
Posted from: 76.175.197.13
December 10th, 2008 23:09
best food: meadows can’t beat the free buffet
Posted from: 205.202.240.124
December 11th, 2008 07:51
The judge I couldn’t think of the other day was Michael Arton. Does he still judge some? He was truly one of the best LD judge–very helpful to students and coaches with his criticism and just incredibly sharp. I ran into John Gibson today and he helped me remember. I think Mike Arton was one of Greg Malis’ students originally; at least Gibson and I thought that was the case.
Fred Robertson
Posted from: 168.69.134.240
December 11th, 2008 08:04
Worst judge/worst RFD has got to be David Donatti hands down. His RFD’s are very unclear.
Best judge AND most helpful RFD is 100% Neil Conrad, no questions asked. He actually sits there and takes his time critiquing, explaining his RFD thoroughly, making sure YOU understand it too, and is completely willing to spend some extra time answering your questions too. He’s the most patient, helpful, and overall just awesome judge.
Most underrated judge:
Jeremy Dudley- he’s an awesome judge.
Posted from: 24.245.28.7
December 11th, 2008 08:16
The unholy brain-trust of Robertson-Gibson? Frightening and…I wish I was there! :)
Arton was not a product of the Malis who was at Newman. Michael was from the sticks of NOLA (Lafayette HS) and makes the occasional reappearance, typically at St. Marks and AV.
Posted from: 208.118.184.3
December 11th, 2008 08:17
Mike Arton is a tax attorney in DC who judges a couple of times a year still. I agree he is a very good judge.
Posted from: 216.162.91.75
December 11th, 2008 08:23
Tournament Awards:
Best Hospitality – Bronx. I’m that needy lone wolf debater who asks for special accomodations, and Bronx definitely
a) is the most likely to comply, and
b) says “no” in the absolute nicest way possible, if necessary.
Best Judging Pool – Bronx or Glenbrooks. I love the ridiculous number of strikes at Glenbrooks; it means that everyone pretty much gets to determine his/her own personal pool. Cruz’s ability to coerce everyone into going to Bronx makes for a great pool as well :p
Best Competition – Glenbrooks
Best Non-bid Tournament – Liberty Bell Classic. Very well run, great judging pool, and fun competition.
Most Efficient Tab Room – Princeton. Really. It definitely exceeded my expectations; people complain year after year about Princeton, but it was incredibly efficient this year. Yay for texting in results!
Best Tournament Food – Bronx. I’m not sure I can handle another weekend of eating cold pizza – tastes of the world is so appreciated.
Best Tournament Location – Princeton; the campus is beautiful, and even the rounds that are “far” are relatively close.
Best Tournament Schedule – Hen Hud; I love two-dayers, and it stays more or less on schedule.
Best Nearby Dining – Yale; there is a fantastic Indian place nearby, as well as a wonderful little Italian place. My mom came along this year and scouted restaurants, not cases. Food is what really matters :p
Most Helpful RFD – Anjan. He cares so much about debate that he’ll take extra time to help anyone out and tell them what they need to do to take it to the next level.
Squirreler – Wes :o)
Best First-Year-Out Judge – Mike Contillo. I’m probably a little biased here, but his RFDs are incredibly in-depth (as much as we tease him for his sub-pointed RFDs). He takes a long time to evaluate every round to make sure that he’s making the right decision, and is always willing/happy to answer debaters’ questions. He really cares about debate, so he really cares about making the right decision. Debaters also seem to find his advice on how to deal with certain arguments and/or how to improve overall to be very helpful.
Posted from: 24.245.28.7
December 11th, 2008 08:38
I think anon (@53) makes two good points in his/her anonymity.
1.) EVERY judge could be confronted by “anons” who suggest that they had an incoherent RFD. Any judge who claims they haven’t given an incoherent RFD is lying or doesn’t really judge very much. Bottom line: incoherent or unhelpful RFD can be levied against any judge including all of the best judges. I think they’d all admit that. I suppose if tons of different people had the same experience, that would means something but they’d probably all hide behind anonymity making the charge pretty baseless. They’d also always come from the perspective of the loser. Anon obviously lost Donatti’s ballot. My guess is that anon’s opponent isn’t going to chime in here and suggest that David’s RFD was unclear. The test of incoherent/unhelpful RFD would probably be if both debaters were to make the charge about the judge’s RFD. That’s your worst judge.
2.) Neil is among the top of the list for best judges. He’s consistently (and it’s relatively easy to obtain data about this) one of the most highly preferred critics and his decisions are always well-reasoned and entirely predictable. When I’ve disagreed with Neil as a judge or coach, I can completely understand his perspective and how he arrived at his decision.
I think it would be interesting to take the preference data from multiple tournaments, aggregate it and determine who the most preferred critics are. I would assume that many names are consistently at the top of that list. But that would be really useful information. If tournament directors sent me the info (the Judge Report from TRPC) I would put it into a spreadsheet and give it to Bietz to post.
It would also be interesting to do that for aff/neg win percentages by topic.
Just some thoughts.
Posted from: 72.254.20.55
December 11th, 2008 09:05
schedule + hospitality + location = meadows
best nearby dining + tournament food = cps
Posted from: 72.254.20.55
December 11th, 2008 09:11
competitor giveaway + regional upstart – harvard westlake
Posted from: 72.254.20.55
December 11th, 2008 09:11
trophies – meadows (charity, except the belt)
Posted from: 128.135.226.180
December 11th, 2008 09:48
schedule+hospitality+location+food+trophies=meadows
Vegas, the best schedule that allows you to sleep till 1pm on saturday, free food, open food to all students in the judges room (unlike every other tournament), the belt, the charities.
might be a bit biased, but anyone who has attended will attest to the same thing.
Posted from: 193.200.150.137
December 11th, 2008 10:20
The biggest disappointment of the year has to be St. Mark’s. I am a coach and have been attending for at least ten years. Needless to say, the tournament has lost a lot of it’s luster. When my program first began attending the tournament, I would say that the competition and judging quality was on par with the Glenbrooks or Greenhill, but in the previous few years both have slipped dramatically.
I don’t know if it is just a coincidence, but the quality of the tournament seemed to coincide with Jane Boyd not being associated with the tournament.
Posted from: 65.88.9.138
December 11th, 2008 10:32
What is a “great judge” in the minds of most people?
I agree with Fred that Michael Arton is a great judge. Over the years he has judged my students countless times, voting for and against them more times than I would like I might add, but you always understand his perspective. Two things that I like about Arton as a judge that I wish others would embrace. First, he has a BS filter as a judge that keeps students honest. This doesn’t mean he won’t vote for arguments that aren’t middle of the road; rather, those advancing such arguments need to be clear and on point from the first speech on (as opposed to the current trend by many students/coaches of engaging in obfuscation/argument avoidance until the final rebuttal where it becomes clear as a bell.
Second, while as a coach he was as competitive as any of us (and now as a judge), debate practices need to be fair and educational while balancing competitive rigor. Arguments (should I say sentences/sentence fragments) that “preclude/exclude” entire speeches ought to have a MUCH higher threshold for acceptance than is currently practiced by many judges.
Arton could judge us in every debate. We would win some and lose some, but I know the foundation of any decision of his is an unbiased evaluation of what he heard in the debate without agendas to push, or worries that he will upset friends if he votes against their students.
I don’t know if I could say that about all judging many big debates at many national events.
I am just saying…
I will say in response to post #56 that any ranking system that lets you personally select your pool (given the smaller pool in most LD tournaments in comparison to policy) is flawed in my opinion given the incestuous nature of the LD community.
What criteria do many of you have as you pref. people at tournaments?
“Good judging? That’s debatable”…sounds like the next VBD discussion :)
Posted from: 206.180.133.79
December 11th, 2008 10:35
+1 to Cherian Koshy…Neil Conrad is a great judge! I think Walt Whitman Parent and 1985 NDT Champion Jonathan Massey might be the best judge around, but maybe I’m just a fanboy, right Anjan?
Posted from: 130.49.58.209
December 11th, 2008 11:06
welp, looks like team wesley will at least be taking home one VBDeeez. throw some on it.
so so so right on meadows. best trophy, best tournament
Posted from: 130.49.58.209
December 11th, 2008 11:13
PS: You better just give wesley the squirrel award now, before you REALLY have to start striking him due to his rage at not being honored. if its good enough for J-Dub, its good enough for everyone!
Posted from: 208.118.184.3
December 11th, 2008 11:36
Agreed with Duby, that Mr. Massey is an excellent judge…and that Duby is a fanboy.
Posted from: 96.229.143.242
December 11th, 2008 12:38
Wes is the poorman’s Fred when it comes to squirreling.
Posted from: 76.186.244.15
December 11th, 2008 13:34
best trophies- rebar neimi (sexy beret)
Posted from: 130.160.199.129
December 11th, 2008 15:00
best rfd: tim hogan. “i want to die after watching this round.” “this is the worst round i have ever seen” “this was completely terrible.”
Posted from: 68.11.25.35
December 11th, 2008 16:07
I’ve found Greg Hertz to be a great judge.
Posted from: 170.140.111.105
December 11th, 2008 17:08
i’m kind of surprised that no one has said this yet, and i know that bietz has tried to make these awards “politically correct”, but the “squirreler” and “most likely to hold up a tournament” awards don’t really make any sense
we can all laugh about how judge x totally squirrels all the time or judge y is a goofball and forgot to turn in his/her ballot so the tournament got delayed by half an hour, but shouldn’t these be issues that actually get resolved? not some random online award that is just a mild jab?
maybe i’m a sourpuss but i don’t find it funny or endearing that whoever wins the “squirreler” award might have put the worse debater further in outrounds because another bad judge was also on the panel or maybe s/he made terrible decisions in prelims that weren’t checked back by two decent judges
Posted from: 130.49.58.209
December 11th, 2008 17:45
ALLAY YOUR FEARS MAESHAL, IT’S NOT LIKE THE ACTIVITY IS ABOUT WINNING AND LOOZING ANYWAYZ.
EDU EDU EDU EDU
Posted from: 67.107.166.135
December 11th, 2008 17:45
Best RFD–Wade Houston:
“So, I found the rap performance to be really horrible. Your rhythm sucked, the background music was bad, and you couldn’t rhyme anything. You told me to vote for you if I was entertained because it’s good for debate, but, unfortunately for you, I was not entertained because YOU SUCKED.”
Posted from: 69.118.137.26
December 11th, 2008 17:58
I agree with Maeshal in the sense that it’s fun to joke about squirreling/bad decisions and make them seem trivial until you (or your debater) suffers one of such decisions. Or to joke about holding up a tournament until you have to wait an extra hour between rounds. I also think that “squirrel” is a poor euphemism that should probably fall out of use.
I nominate dave mcginnis for best judge.
Posted from: 209.30.244.88
December 11th, 2008 18:01
mideastbeast94 (Maeshal) (6:39:26 PM): i’m kind of curious as to what people will say
slduby (6:39:32 PM): Rebar will have
slduby (6:39:34 PM): 9 paragraphs
slduby (6:39:37 PM): all in caps
Note the timestamps, folks!
Posted from: 68.196.201.226
December 11th, 2008 19:25
I have to agree with Janda on best RFD. Though I was not there to witness the rap or the RFD, the stories seem to speak for themselves.
Posted from: 98.114.207.11
December 11th, 2008 19:49
Actually, here is the exact wording of Wade’s RFD (thanks to Annie)–
“You are terrible at rap. even if bittersweet symphony wasn’t playing in the background, this would still be awful. you have zero cohesion and absolutely no structure. my ears are about to start gushing blood. your NC is the worst seven minutes of my life, and you’re only three minutes in.
RFD: you said I should vote neg if I was entertained. too bad you SUCKED
Posted from: 68.104.1.44
December 11th, 2008 21:13
Seems like Wade’s in the running for best FYO judge.
Posted from: 12.216.111.70
December 11th, 2008 22:46
The Sunvitational at the University School in Florida is a serious contender for many of these awards.
Best Non-bid Tournament: great location, great critics like Stephen Renzi, Steve Schappaugh, and Ernie Rose
Best Upstart Tournament- Its the first year of the Sunvitational and from what I have heard it was nothing less than incredible.
(Stephen Renzi: “The Sunvitational was incredible”
Ross Brown: “I feel nothing but regret for not attending the 08 Sunvitational.”)
Best Trophies- They were modeled after surfboards and buses.
Attendance at the 2009 Sunvitational should be a major consideration for any serious debater on the circuit.
Posted from: 130.49.58.209
December 12th, 2008 12:20
IT IS SPOOOKY HOW WELL MR DUBY KNOWS ME. I BLAME OUR ON-THE-COURT COMPETITION.
Posted from: 204.8.196.66
December 12th, 2008 14:42
I would say that there’s a bit of a false premise in Maeshals post about squirreling. I don’t think judges who “squirrel” are by necessity bad judges. I have been to tournaments where I almost constantly watch the “good judges” on the bottoms of 2-1 decisions where the round was clear as day. A good example of this is every new york state tournament I have ever gone to. Some times the decision is just wrong.
On to some nominations:
Tournament Awards:
Best Hospitality:
Well…Not princeton. One time they had me sleeping on the floor of the tab room as a judge. Fun times. I would say the Lex RR is up there for this award. Great housing, good food, and good people.
Best Tournament Food:
Gotta go with Bronx on this one. Great food, I eat enough cold pizza in college.
Best Tournament Location:
Columbia. Kick-ass. Right in the middle of NYC.
Best Tournament Schedule
I don’t really have a nomination for the best, but I can say that by far the worst schedule I have ever encountered occurs at Princeton. 2 hours between rounds? Rounds at 2 am? Ugh.
Best Nearby Dining
Yale. There is this little sub shop at Yale with makes my heart tingle.
Squirreler:
Is cruz getting some love for this award? I’ve seen him squirrel so many times…
Point Fairy:
Cruz, again.
Posted from: 76.94.89.102
December 12th, 2008 15:06
The irony is, of course, that while everyone was up in arms about making judges or tournaments feel bad because they might be mentioned as an “overrated judge” or “inefficient,” we seem to LOVE rfds that make kids feel bad.
Posted from: 72.213.162.95
December 12th, 2008 15:54
Nope, no irony, haha
Posted from: 72.213.162.95
December 12th, 2008 16:32
I think it’s stupid either way.
Posted from: 170.140.111.105
December 12th, 2008 18:23
shea,
there is a difference between good judges squirreling every so often and having a reputation as a squirrel. i don’t really see why this distinction has to be explained, but here it goes:
lots of judges squirrel. that’s no big deal. people make mistakes, people see rounds differently, whatever. there’s nothing wrong with that. however, being known as a squirrel is different because it means that there is a consistent pattern of dissenting.
i don’t think i have ever heard of anyone gaining a reputation as a squirrel by being on bottom time and time again at the new york state tournament, so i don’t see your point as responsive. judges who consistently squirrel at bid tournaments across the country throughout the year is clearly more systemic than what happens at one state tournament.
also, bietz, i also don’t really see it as ironic either because the people who posted the mean RFDs were probably not the same people who were up in arms about making judges and tournaments feel bad.
Posted from: 72.213.162.95
December 12th, 2008 19:01
Great points, Maeshal
Posted from: 69.181.134.250
December 12th, 2008 19:06
is there going to be alta page
anybody know what’s going on
best tournament-harker
best food- harker
everything harker except best location. Obviously, Meadow baby in vega
Posted from: 24.10.187.161
December 12th, 2008 23:02
Re: Alta
As far as I know there are 3 6-0′s going into the 7th perlime, those are Michael Mezzatesta, Tim McHugh, and Tarun Galagali. I am 5-1 w/ 30′s for speaks for all of my rounds except 1 (confirmed) and the only reason I don’t know the 1 is the judge didn’t say. Oliver is 5-1 (assuming Tarun beat him, which I heard but could be wrong).
Posted from: 24.245.28.7
December 13th, 2008 23:12
Tim Hogan = best judge/best RFD
1. He judges EVERY debate from prelim 1 to finals at EVERY tournament. Primarily because Cherian says he just won’t be there in time. Tim always falls for that one. Longevity should count for something even if he can’t tell you anything about the arguments in the round.
2. Best RFD: “You were both just SILLY. You started the silliness so you lose.” CLASSIC.
Posted from: 24.245.28.7
December 13th, 2008 23:14
Oh, and if we are going back to the way back when judges – I nominate Joe Schoenig for best judge/best RFDs. Always cared about the decisions he made and made a genuine effort to make sure that the kids understood his decisions. Wish he would come back to the activity!
Posted from: 207.45.93.162
December 17th, 2008 13:43
Weave Schappaugh is the best judge
Posted from: 12.20.33.10
December 20th, 2008 13:36
DAVE MCGINNIS